Corsair Grand Touring Battery Charging / Draining Issues

[NJRonbo]

Hello everyone!

Day two with my brand-new Grand Touring. Really enjoying the vehicle thus far.

Since I am sort of new to PHEV and how it all works, I have a question about the battery drain...

I plugged in my car overnight to my 110 volt home plug. It took approx. 13 hours to charge. It was in the teens overnight, so very cold.

This morning, I ran an errand and had the car in CONSERVATIVE mode. I believe that is equivalent to ECO mode and that is where I plan to keep the vehicle to maximize fuel efficiency.

Still, under that driving mode, the battery is being drained. I take it it's because the vehicle is running in hybrid mode. However, shouldn't the vehicle be replacing that battery power as quickly as I am using it since it's a combo of gas and battery hybrid?

If the battery is supposed to drain, will it be a substantial drain in CONSERVATIVE mode and can I keep running the vehicle in that mode without ever having to plug it in?

I plan to use FULL EV mode at some point, but right now, I just want to use it as a hybrid.

Thanks in advance for the help

 

[mfjj]

Hello everyone!

Day two with my brand-new Grand Touring. Really enjoying the vehicle thus far.

Since I am sort of new to PHEV and how it all works, I have a question about the battery drain...

I plugged in my car overnight to my 110 volt home plug. It took approx. 13 hours to charge. It was in the teens overnight, so very cold.

This morning, I ran an errand and had the car in CONSERVATIVE mode. I believe that is equivalent to ECO mode and that is where I plan to keep the vehicle to maximize fuel efficiency.

Still, under that driving mode, the battery is being drained. I take it it's because the vehicle is running in hybrid mode. However, shouldn't the vehicle be replacing that battery power as quickly as I am using it since it's a combo of gas and battery hybrid?

If the battery is supposed to drain, will it be a substantial drain in CONSERVATIVE mode and can I keep running the vehicle in that mode without ever having to plug it in?

I plan to use FULL EV mode at some point, but right now, I just want to use it as a hybrid.

Thanks in advance for the help

Hi NJRonbo, glad you are enjoying the GT thus far. The Conservative mode is for conserving fuel consumption. It actually prioritizes EV usage. Yes, you can keep running the vehicle in that mode without ever having to plug it in.

You can use the GT as a hybrid. If you don't plug it in, and don't use the Preserve EV mode (which burns fuel to charge the EV battery), the GT functions just like your old hybrid, regen and all. Just ignore the EV range display. True, at 33 the MPG might be less than stellar (and the small gas tank doesn't help), but remember this is an SUV and it carries a heavy battery that you don't take full advantage of. Besides, since you are skilled at driving a hybrid I'm sure you can do better than 33. And there is always that nice tax credit to cushion the blow Don't forget to check the state and local incentives, including utility company, HOV privileges, toll discounts, etc. NJ has a lot of that going on.

 

[RedHoncho]

Hello everyone!

Day two with my brand-new Grand Touring. Really enjoying the vehicle thus far.

Since I am sort of new to PHEV and how it all works, I have a question about the battery drain...

I plugged in my car overnight to my 110 volt home plug. It took approx. 13 hours to charge. It was in the teens overnight, so very cold.

This morning, I ran an errand and had the car in CONSERVATIVE mode. I believe that is equivalent to ECO mode and that is where I plan to keep the vehicle to maximize fuel efficiency.

Still, under that driving mode, the battery is being drained. I take it it's because the vehicle is running in hybrid mode. However, shouldn't the vehicle be replacing that battery power as quickly as I am using it since it's a combo of gas and battery hybrid?

If the battery is supposed to drain, will it be a substantial drain in CONSERVATIVE mode and can I keep running the vehicle in that mode without ever having to plug it in?

I plan to use FULL EV mode at some point, but right now, I just want to use it as a hybrid.

Thanks in advance for the help

One thing you will notice is the cold weather does affect the EV battery range. The range shown on your vehicle display is more of a guideline than actual range much as your gas tank levels.

Your driving habits will also affect EV range. I have tested out most of the driving modes. Preserve EV will utilize the ICE engine and will keep the battery charged at around 80% range. It will also consume the most gasoline. I tested it out on the highway for 175 miles and got 25.7 MPG. It was a bit surprising. I have also used the Excite mode which gives a very sporty feeling to the drive. With the exception of Pure EV, all modes will charge the HV battery when you brake or coast, but only up to 80% charge. Full charging must be done at either your home charging point or a Level 2 charge station.

As a side note, your 12V battery needs some love too. This means you need to drive with the ICE engine engaged a few times per week to keep it charged up. Otherwise, you will get a message on the Lincoln Way app that your vehicle has entered deep sleep mode to preserve the battery. It took me a few weeks to figure this out as I was assuming it was an error because I had my vehicle plugged in to recharge. The weather was very moderate here and I had been driving around town and never used the ICE engine.

I hope you enjoy your new GT as much as I am enjoying mine.

 

[Pabaldeagle]

If the battery is supposed to drain, will it be a substantial drain in CONSERVATIVE mode and can I keep running the vehicle in that mode without ever having to plug it in?

A plug in hybrid expects to be plugged in on occasion if not every time it has partially to fully discharged. That's where the real conservation comes from (using more electric and less gas). Look to have a 240VAC outlet installed. They are cheap (under $200 labor?) and reduce charge time to 3 hours.

As far as how your various engines work, look for an icon on your display that says "Power Flow". This graphic shows which motors are running; electric, gas, and the flow of recharge. Check it out in the various drive modes. I found Conserve seems to mean conserve "gas" ie use electric first (this is experiential - check my thread on modes) and the regen braking is much more aggressive, slowing you as soon as you remove your foot from the accelerator.

Enjoy the new ride!

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[NJRonbo]

RedHoncho and Pabaleagle,

Firstly, I am getting a wealth of great information here. You guys have been terrific and very helpful. I look forward to the many years that I will be a member here checking in with questions.

When you talk about giving my 12volt battery some loving -- is "conservative" mode what you mean by driving with ICE engaged to keep it charged up? Or do you mean driving pure EV and doing a few nightly charges?

The charging aspect scares me. I watched a lot of YouTube videos and it seems that if you don't charge your battery correctly (or too often) the performance will deteriorate rather quickly. I watched the videos a while back and I don't remember exactly what you should or should not do, but it kind of turned me off into getting a PHEV vehicle. This is kind of scaring me into charging it nightly, every day, so I can use it in pure EV around town. I don't want to kill the battery before its time.

I will look for the "Power Flow" icon. So far I haven't seen it on the many screens that index through on the digital cluster but I'll reference it in the handbook and find it. Thanks for that tip.

 

[mfjj]

The high-voltage battery does need a lot of TLC but that has all been designed in. The system manages the charging level, speed, cooling, etc. automatically. I have plugged in a PHEV nightly for five years now. These days, they all have some kind of battery performance guarantee, something like 80% capacity after 8 years.

A BEV like Tesla is a different story. There are strategies to optimize things. For example, you don't need to plug in every day unless you plan to drive 300 miles the next day. Topping off that last 60 miles of range is suboptimal. It's like going to the gas station when the tank is still 80% full.

As long as you plan to keep the GT in a garage, I highly recommend that you plug it in, and preferably run a 240V line to the garage. The included charger has a 6-20P plug. It's meant for a 20 AMP line. If you want to "future proof" and run a 50 or even 60 AMP line, just add a $50 adapter. Or, you can go whole hog and install a $500 level-2 charger (plus the cost of the new line), and save the included charger for mobile use.

One nice perk for plugging in: You can preheat the GT in the garage without running the engine or losing any EV range. You can do this from your app or even set a schedule for it.

 

[Pabaldeagle]

When you talk about giving my 12volt battery some loving -- is "conservative" mode what you mean by driving with ICE engaged to keep it charged up? Or do you mean driving pure EV and doing a few nightly charges?

This forum's members have been great. It has been frustrating to not have clear and accurate data from Lincoln, but we users have speculated that the 12VDC battery does NOT receive any charging while you are charging the high voltage battery.

The 12 VDC only charges when the internal combustion engine (ICE) runs. ICE runs when the battery needs charging (hopefully it runs long enough to charge it to adequate levels), when the car demands more oomph (technical term) such as when you select "Excite", Preserve, or touch the paddle shifters. They only way to "force" the car to run ICE is to select Preserve EV or Excite. I find it better to have a highway drive once in a while and let "Normal" determine when to kick in the ICE. If you pick "Conserve", you won't engage ICE unless torque requires, high voltage is exhausted, or paddle down shifting.

In response to getting the "deep sleep" or "no remote commnciations" warning from phone as a key, my dealer recommended driving with ICE enough to have the alternator charge the battery, or use a trickle charger when parked (pah-lease!). So far, I've managed to let the ICE run long enough to avoid a dead battery (which if that happens I'm told you will not be able to use even the high voltage to propel the car. Plan on an old fashioned jump.)

 

[mfjj]

This forum's members have been great. It has been frustrating to not have clear and accurate data from Lincoln, but we users have speculated that the 12VDC battery does NOT receive any charging while you are charging the high voltage battery.

The 12 VDC only charges when the internal combustion engine (ICE) runs. ICE runs when the battery needs charging (hopefully it runs long enough to charge it to adequate levels), when the car demands more oomph (technical term) such as when you select "Excite", Preserve, or touch the paddle shifters. They only way to "force" the car to run ICE is to select Preserve EV or Excite. I find it better to have a highway drive once in a while and let "Normal" determine when to kick in the ICE. If you pick "Conserve", you won't engage ICE unless torque requires, high voltage is exhausted, or paddle down shifting.

In response to getting the "deep sleep" or "no remote commnciations" warning from phone as a key, my dealer recommended driving with ICE enough to have the alternator charge the battery, or use a trickle charger when parked (pah-lease!). So far, I've managed to let the ICE run long enough to avoid a dead battery (which if that happens I'm told you will not be able to use even the high voltage to propel the car. Plan on an old fashioned jump.)

As I mentioned in another thread, the owner manual claims that "The 12 volt battery maintains power if left plugged in." But this didn't work for Pabaldeagel. I have my doubts too. My Fusion Energi made the same claim but I found that I had to also turn on the car to make it happen. At least the engine doesn't need to run and the car turns itself off after 30 minutes, so this is not too bad. I hope someone can confirm this behavior on the Corsair GT, perhaps with a voltmeter?

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[Pabaldeagle]

the owner manual claims that "The 12 volt battery maintains power if left plugged in

Certainly let us know. I've written off the manual claim. like bigfoot, as an "Urban legend". I want to see the reference myself. And then still explain why I get "remote unavailable" and "deep sleep" when I drive everyday and charge every other day.

 

[NJRonbo]

So….

There are a lot of pointers here. Since I am new to all this could someone simply bullet point the best way to maintain the batteries and occasional driving modes to optimize.

In other words, quick Cliffnotes on what to do.

For example….

If I want to use this vehicle mostly as a hybrid rather than EV, should I charge every day anyway?

One of you said you charge every night for many years. Should I do the same? I don’t keep my car in the garage.

What driving mode should I occasionally use just to do some good for the battery?

Just put it all out there in simple steps so an idiot like me can follow a laid-out set of instructions.

I’ll also see if so can find YouTube videos on the topic.

 

[Pabaldeagle]

Perhaps read this? "You can't drive PHEVs like a regular hybrid because while they can recharge their battery while driving, it's best you charge the battery separately."

The Kuga is the Escape is the Corsair...

Article also links to BMW videos on PHEV's. BMW's "Hybrid Eco Pro" seems to be our "Conserve". This is the most energy conservative mode (slower acceleration, faster deceleration), and will run down battery rather than burn gas.

Car is smart enough to run ICE (ie "normal") when needed to charge 12 VDC.

Least cost to operate? Run "conserve".

 

[mfjj]

So….


If I want to use this vehicle mostly as a hybrid rather than EV, should I charge every day anyway?

No.

One of you said you charge every night for many years. Should I do the same? I don’t keep my car in the garage.

I'm that guy. No, if I didn't keep it in the garage I wouldn't bother with charging at all. Then again, I wouldn't be buying this car.

What driving mode should I occasionally use just to do some good for the battery?

Since you won't be charging it, and the gas engine will be engaged all the time, any mode is fine. Conserve is the most efficient if that's your main goal.

Just put it all out there in simple steps so an idiot like me can follow a laid-out set of instructions.

I’ll also see if so can find YouTube videos on the topic.

______________________________

 

[silverydragon72]

So….

There are a lot of pointers here. Since I am new to all this could someone simply bullet point the best way to maintain the batteries and occasional driving modes to optimize.

In other words, quick Cliffnotes on what to do.

For example….

If I want to use this vehicle mostly as a hybrid rather than EV, should I charge every day anyway?

One of you said you charge every night for many years. Should I do the same? I don’t keep my car in the garage.

What driving mode should I occasionally use just to do some good for the battery?

Just put it all out there in simple steps so an idiot like me can follow a laid-out set of instructions.

I’ll also see if so can find YouTube videos on the topic.

For mine I have it set to a schedule in the app to only charge and certain times which optimize the cost since I am on one of those time of day use plans. I typically do the L1 charging when I don't need to use it and just leave it plugged in so its fully charged before my next trip. If I need to use it right after driving it that's when I go with a L2 charger. Typically as with most batteries fully draining it then recharging it is best and I believe the L1 charger is better long term compared with the L2 but takes significantly longer. Also just FYI mine goes into deep sleep often but always starts without issues.

 

[NJRonbo]

Had to take a photo. This astounded me and it went as high as 78MPG at its best.

This was in conservative mode. So I take it this is the best MPG mode as it makes full use of the electric and gas?

 

[Pabaldeagle]

In Conserve your car accelerates slowest and decelerates fastest (max regen) so in general, yes best mode to save gas/electric-energy. But, Pure EV will give you the best “miles per gallon” (of gas) for the first 25-30 miles since you’re burning NO gas. This is how (with my short commute) I’m 1000+ miles burning 12 gallons. Enjoy!

 

[NJRonbo]

In Conserve your car accelerates slowest and decelerates fastest (max regen) so in general, yes best mode to save gas/electric-energy. But, Pure EV will give you the best “miles per gallon” (of gas) for the first 25-30 miles since you’re burning NO gas. This is how (with my short commute) I’m 1000+ miles burning 12 gallons. Enjoy!

But once you run through all the electric your car loses its hybrid capacity and you are purely using gas at 20-25ish MPG.

…or is the hybrid a separate battery so it will continue working in that mode even when EV is used up?

Just clarifying

PS: So, if I am correct, best to charge vehicle nightly and run it pure EV and use as little gas as possible afterward.

______________________________

 

[Pabaldeagle]

Good question. My use case allows me to never be without charge (range showing on the electric range gauge). I wish I had an official source of "truth" other than personal experience and inference, but every brake, every deceleration charges the EV battery a bit so it always has "some" electric capacity. The 2.5L "Atkinson" engine is notoriously poor at low speed torque so it relies on the electric motors to start car movement from a stop (but is more efficient at running speeds so a great combination for PHEV).

 

[RedHoncho]

But once you run through all the electric your car loses its hybrid capacity and you are purely using gas at 20-25ish MPG.

…or is the hybrid a separate battery so it will continue working in that mode even when EV is used up?

Just clarifying

PS: So, if I am correct, best to charge vehicle nightly and run it pure EV and use as little gas as possible afterward.

Once you’ve depleted the HV battery the ICE will engage and the vehicle will function as a hybrid with city and highway MPG rating of 33 MPG. As you coast or brake the vehicle will send charge to the HV. Of course, this is assuming you’re driving in the Normal setting.

 

[NJRonbo]

Once you’ve depleted the HV battery the ICE will engage and the vehicle will function as a hybrid with city and highway MPG rating of 33 MPG. As you coast or brake the vehicle will send charge to the HV. Of course, this is assuming you’re driving in the Normal setting.

Okay so it sounds most optimal to run on Pure Electric then the vehicle should switch to normal and run as a hybrid with 38MPG

 

[NJRonbo]

A great video on getting optimal mileage with a PHEV. Question to follow at the end of the videos...

Some tips on charging the PHEV.

So, I am storing my car in the garage. A very dangerous thing to do as the opening of the garage is tight. I am afraid one of these days I am going to scrape/dent the vehicle backing it in. However, it's advantageous for charging.

Question: How do I set the car up for preconditioning? In other words, how can I start it so the car heats up while plugged in so that energy is not wasted? Are there preconditioning settings somewhere? And all I need to do is start the vehicle with the keyfob and as long as the drive mode is in Pure EV it will always start in that mode?