bank cat 2 check engine
- Thread starter Alkemist
- Start date
I finally got an ob2 in the mail and screenshotted all of the info, if possible, i would appreciate it if you would let me know if you see any problems as the cel keeps coming back. let me know if any other info is needed or missing, i did it with the car started
Town
Senior Member
Those are a lot of screen shots. The last one showing the single DTC that you have for P0430 is the original problem with insufficient oxygen removal between the 2 oxygen sensors for bank 2 (grille bank of cylinders). That would normally be a faulty CAT that cannot use up the oxygen to reduce emission level (excess gas or oil will destroy the CAT, or a faulty sensor which would could be the heated oxygen sensor since the HCAT is problematic in the I/M readiness screen. The rear oxygen sensor seems to have been cleared in the I/M readiness monitor. The heated O2 sensor is the first one in the exhaust manifold. Problems with the heated O2 sensor will give driveability issues.
The first screen shot (bottom of prior page 4 of this thread) shows the I/M readiness for a emission test, and it is not ready. You have a red DTC marker which is the P0430 and one Pd DTC which is a pending dtc that a problem was detected on one occasion but needs a confirmation on a second run of the same problem (an example would be inability to retain pressure in fuel tank for a leak test must occur on 2 successive runs, so first run with leak detected is a pending DTC).
The AIR is probably the secondary air injection into the CAT for quicker emission reduction, but not sure about your car since the air pump is old technology. More research on the 3.7 to figure that one out. The HCAT is the heated oxygen sensor probably for bank 2 since you have P0430 that applies to that problem.
Hope this helps you.
Thanks a lot. I spent half a day trying to learn this. So basically the cat most likely is faulty i assume? The car has been lagging in pickup, the bank 2 is near the front bumper to confirm?, at dealer about $337.
Town
Senior Member
No not the CAT, the heated o2 sensor. The test said the CAT is ok. The HCAT is the heated oxygen sensor. You are correct on bank 2 being close to the bumper, since bank 1 is close to firewall.
The lagging in pickup would be a driveability issue related perhaps to the problem readings from the heated oxygen sensor. I think i already gave you the procedure to replace the sensor. Check that it was for your 3.7 engine.
Oh nice, thats much more palatable, the o2 sensors are much cheaper, i will change both sensors in bank 2. And yes, i have the procedures printed
Todor
Active member
Hi, change all sensors, so bank 1 and 2 have the same ones.
O2 sensors are voltage generators, i.e. their read is in V.
Drive it, set the cruise control at steady speed 50-55 mph and monitor the problematic O2 sensor output.
Upstream sensors should go around 0.5V. Provided they are narrow band. Stoichiometric or Lambda 1 with wide band would be 2.5V. But it could be directly interpreted by it's controller and represented in counts, load, A/F or Lambda. Lambda 1 is 1x14.7 (or 14.65) Lambda 2 is close to 30:1 and Lambda 0.5 is close to 7.5:1 - Lambda applies to both narrow and wide band sensors.
Downstream sensors should read less O2 i.e. more voltage. So your 0.7-0.8V readouts make sense.
Maybe they are slow or the cat is really gone.
My bet is still on spitting injectors or something missfiring. And this should be taken out of consideration before replacing any emission equipment as unsolved ignition/injection issue will damage components very fast and in exactly the same way. You changed plugs. You can now move all bank 1 ignition coils to bank 2 and vice versa. Just switch coils between banks and see if the problem moves to the other bank.
Video:
O2 sensors are voltage generators, i.e. their read is in V.
Drive it, set the cruise control at steady speed 50-55 mph and monitor the problematic O2 sensor output.
Upstream sensors should go around 0.5V. Provided they are narrow band. Stoichiometric or Lambda 1 with wide band would be 2.5V. But it could be directly interpreted by it's controller and represented in counts, load, A/F or Lambda. Lambda 1 is 1x14.7 (or 14.65) Lambda 2 is close to 30:1 and Lambda 0.5 is close to 7.5:1 - Lambda applies to both narrow and wide band sensors.
Downstream sensors should read less O2 i.e. more voltage. So your 0.7-0.8V readouts make sense.
Maybe they are slow or the cat is really gone.
My bet is still on spitting injectors or something missfiring. And this should be taken out of consideration before replacing any emission equipment as unsolved ignition/injection issue will damage components very fast and in exactly the same way. You changed plugs. You can now move all bank 1 ignition coils to bank 2 and vice versa. Just switch coils between banks and see if the problem moves to the other bank.
Video:
Attachments
jhartz
Junior Member
At 90K miles, this may be just a bad O2 sensor on bank two (easiest to get to and easy to replace). On my Cadillac and 88 BMW, the O2 sensors were failing around 80K miles (haven't owned anything with that many miles since). Worth a shot.
But, I still believe you have spitting injectors -- once upon a time you used to be able to put your finger on each and tell which had a different pulse width.
Another likely suspect is a dirty MAF sensor: since most of these Continentals are fairly new (I had only 23K on Bambi killer), not many of us have seen bad MAF sensors -- yet! Trying cleaning it with CRC MAF cleaner; also check the wiring at the sensor.
But, I still believe you have spitting injectors -- once upon a time you used to be able to put your finger on each and tell which had a different pulse width.
Another likely suspect is a dirty MAF sensor: since most of these Continentals are fairly new (I had only 23K on Bambi killer), not many of us have seen bad MAF sensors -- yet! Trying cleaning it with CRC MAF cleaner; also check the wiring at the sensor.
Town
Senior Member
I searched the 3.7 engine info and found that AIR on the I/M readiness table refers to the engine intake air system. The 3.7 does not seem to use a MAF but instead uses a MAP sensor. There is no mention of a MAF sensor, and that is supported by the intake air temperature (IAT sensor) being a separate sensor in the air cleaner box instead of being integrated into the MAF as would be expected. So perhaps the MAP should be replaced (to correct the AIR error), and as contributing to the driveability concerns. Make one change at a time, so delay any other changes until several days of driving have ben completed (drive cycle).
So the MAP sensor is located on the upper air intake manifold at the front (where the serpentine belt is located. It's location is shown in the attached pdf file. The procedure to replace the MAF is also attached.
In searching the 3.7 manual it appears the HCAT is more likely the second downstream oxygen sensor rather than the first, as I thought earlier.
So the MAP sensor is located on the upper air intake manifold at the front (where the serpentine belt is located. It's location is shown in the attached pdf file. The procedure to replace the MAF is also attached.
In searching the 3.7 manual it appears the HCAT is more likely the second downstream oxygen sensor rather than the first, as I thought earlier.
Hmmmm. Surprised no maf sensor. I will take a look at the map and replace it. Appreciate it. So i guess i shouldnt change the bank 2 o2s?
Ive prbbly put about a gallon of fuel injector cleaner over the past weeks; and everytime the check engine came off for a while; maybe it just is some dirty fuel injectorts.
the way its been driving, its like its sticky outta first gear and then it goes zoom.
Ill further check the coils and do the scanning graph whilst driving on saturday.
Ive prbbly put about a gallon of fuel injector cleaner over the past weeks; and everytime the check engine came off for a while; maybe it just is some dirty fuel injectorts.
the way its been driving, its like its sticky outta first gear and then it goes zoom.
Ill further check the coils and do the scanning graph whilst driving on saturday.
Todor
Active member
Or a misfiring coil for which we have another sort of proof - very old spark plugs can damage coils.
Alkemist, does the car consume any oil and does the oil smell of fuel? (nose sampling from filler cap)
Town
Senior Member
Yes a surprise to me too, but it looks like the MAP sensor is faulty. See if replacing that fixes anything. I would think a MAP sensor would cause a DTC. The after CAT oxygen sensor would be the next suspect.
Good luck.
Todor
Active member
BTW, map sensor readings could be reviewed in real time through the engineering test menu - back arrow and OK button held together while starting up.
How's it going?
How's it going?
So the cars been running great, knock on wood, i didnt want to update and get unlucky w the cel popping back up. so last weekend all i did was clean the entire engine bay with soap and water, changed the cabin filter. The cel was gone 2 weeks ago on its own, than popped up couple days later, but last weekend it went away, then last weekend before the cleaning and cabin filter change, cel popped back up and car was sluggish.
I didnt want to put in the o2s and do other work just in case it may have been that as you said, fuel injector issue which would make sense with the lag in pickup everytime the cel did pop up, and when it went away, the car would drive perfect.
so far ive driven the car like normal, short rides, the cel has not popped back up, and appears to be gone for good.
I think whatever was stuck in the cat, o2 or injectors just needed time, and clean fuel and additives to clean itself out. bc as I said, previous owners didnt do much maintenance, the plugs were old, the air and cabin filters look like they werent changed in a while if ever.
so for anyone wondering about the issues on the car itself at 91k miles, besides changing air and cabin filter, spark plugs only, and oil change, i havent done anything else and its driving amazing! cant wait to go see the NY version of the alps (since Todor has the scenic drives) in the berkshires driving this haaaaaa.
G
G-658891
3.5L Ecoboost not 3.7
 | ||||
 |  |  |  |  |
 |  | |||
